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Wear this combo, it works.

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Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #15 on: August 11, 2012, 10:19:30 PM »
Sorry guys, but the acceptance forum is over here: http://www.gynecomastia.org/smf/17/

With that said, it's OK if you want to accept it, but most people here are young and advising them to accept it or telling them having breasts is normal, is just dangerous.

"dangerous" is an interesting term for something that will not physically harm you.

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Offline hammer

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Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #16 on: August 12, 2012, 09:28:17 AM »
Sorry guys, but the acceptance forum is over here: http://www.gynecomastia.org/smf/17/

With that said, it's OK if you want to accept it, but most people here are young and advising them to accept it or telling them having breasts is normal, is just dangerous.

"dangerous" is an interesting term for something that will not physically harm you.


TigerPaws, do you remember my post when I referred to the younger generation being the ( gold star generation ) ?

Everyone makes the team even though they suck! They even get a gold star or trophy!
Everyone gets a gold star even though they failed, we don't want to cause emotional harm!
Don't use red pen correcting papers as red is demeaning!
They show up for work in flip flops and ripped jeans, and one hour late and want there gold star!

They can't handle the pimple on the face, rejection, or the truth for that matter!

DON'T GET ME WRONG, NOT ALL YOUNG PEOPLE FIT IN THIS DISCRIPTION, HOWEVER, MANY DO, AND YOU MAY OR MAY NOT KNOW WHO YOU ARE!

WITH ALL THIS SAID, IT IS EACH PERSONS RIGHT TO ACCEPT, OR REJECT THIS CONDITION, AND WE MUST RESPECT THAT AND OFFER SUPPORT EITHER WAY OR NOT POST ON THE TREADS THAT WE DISAGREE WITH. I KNOW THAT THIS IS HARD TO DO! SOME OF THE PEOPLE HAVE IDEAS THAT ( I have been to collage, I have knowlage, what the hell do you even know )? THEN WE HAVE US OLD FARTS WHO HAVE BEEN THERE, DONE IT AND HAVE LIVED IT! There was a time we would not pay any attention to anyone either.

If I have offended anyone, oh well, that is life, you will get over it!

I will support you if you plan to have surgery, but don't whine if you feel that you made a bad decision, as it was your decision no one was forcing you to do it, if you plan to accept it I will also suport as well, it is your life and your decision and we are here to support each other.

Sorry for the long rant, it time to move on and stop the fight!


Bob aka Hammer
I'd rather be hated for who I am, then loved for who I'm not!

I am who I am,  and I'm not going to change to please anyone!

https://www.gynecomastia.org/smf/index.php?topic=24515.0

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Monkey83

Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #17 on: August 12, 2012, 11:10:29 AM »
Then according to your belief in the definition you posted above and your original post do you believe that if someone has a deformed appearance they should be treated differently by society? What is different in your eyes? Would you agree to be shunned by society? To forcefully imprison someone from societies eyes? Should any person who is deformed by your standards be forced at gunpoint to have a surgical procedure or maybe murdered for the greater good?

I and 60% of the worlds male population have developed breasts to one extent or another, assuming as you are reading, researching and commenting on this forum you have to whatever extent developed breasts; then why not end your perceived suffering and have whatever surgical procedure you desire. Then should you survive you would be free to spread your hatred of those you perceive as different from whatever norm you believe others should conform to.
   
[/quote]

Thanks annoyed30, Xavier for attempting to put out the flames here.

I wasn't going to reply any more to this thread, but I feel compelled to do so since, the bigotry and the Nazi card have been played.

Every mammal has breast tissue which is normal. However, excessive or palpable breast tissue in men (Man breasts) is not normal. It is "Dangerous" to advise kids that it is normal, because that does not fall within the capacity of social norms. Unfortunately, this matters in terms of a child's social development. Also, to clarify, while I am stating that it is a deformity and that it is not normal, I am not saying that it wrong or that a person's self esteem should be affected. I am simply saying it is a problem, we are all dealing with it, so let's not be delusional and be as objective as possible.

I understand that there are people who are hypersensitive about this, but that's no reason to set kids up for failure. There is a reasonable surgical procedure to get rid of this. Kids should be screened for it as soon as possible, and then it should be corrected. The reality is, for all of us who have lived with this into their 30's and 40's someone or some thing failed us along the way. It's psychologically and emotionally traumatic for most of us who have it, and we should treat it as legitimate medical issue. Just for the record, anyone of you who keeps preaching the "it's normal, I am old and have lived life, you don't have to have surgery mantra" are perpetuating the same unhealthy attitudes that parents have when not confronting the issue with their kids and allow them to go through life with this condition.

I am not saying you are bad people by any means, I think the opposite actually. The fact that you respond so passionately says to me your hearts are in the right place but you perception has to shift to confront the issue objectively.

Do I get a gold star for my essay? :)

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Offline hammer

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Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #18 on: August 12, 2012, 11:54:51 AM »
Dr. Jacobs and I tried  to get a letter campaign going to the dr. Oz show in hopes that we could educate society about gynecomastia and also get the surgery covered by insurance companies more. I do not know how many people took the time to do this and you can find these threads somewhere in gynecomastia talk. We had hope to remove the TABOO FROM IT THE SAME WAS IT WAS REMOVED FROM ED.

Us older guys did not have surgery options when we were younger, so we had to learn to live with it or handle things however one did. I had a very good self esteem and self confidence so I lived life to its fullests and never without female friends. In fact, more female then male friends.

I can't speak for all the other older guys, but I have offered to help the younger guys that could not afford surgery work on how they look at them selves. After all there is much, much more that makes up a man then some fat, breast tissue and skin! It is much like a eating disorder for some of these people that post that are as flat chest as can be! They see something in the mirror that just isn't there, just as the skin and bones anorexic person sees a fat person in the mirror.

As for your gold star? You can decide that!

P.S. No we don't want to set them up for failure, we also do not want to make them into cry babies either!

Our jobs as adults, Moms, Dads mentors ect... Is to raise productive mature adults not children!




Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #19 on: August 14, 2012, 09:30:47 PM »
I completely agree with Monkey. It's amazing how defensive some on this thread became with the notion that gynecomastia is "not normal." We come up with all kinds of misleading, obscure statistics like 60% of men have gynecomastia "of some kind." Well apparently they must have all gone to your high school because when we played shirts and skins in PE, I was the only one with gyno. I was the only one praying I got picked to the shirts team. There is nothing normal about "man boobs."

Monkey is right, there are some super defensive man boobers who are doing a disservice to the thousands of youth who are struggling dealing with this condition. Gynecomastia by definition is an "abnormal development of large mammary glands in males." Sorry if you don't like the definition, but it's a fact. The reason we come to this site and search out support groups is because we know it's not normal and has been difficult to live with. And to suggest that calling it the abnormality that it is makes me unsympathetic to those born with or through service to our country acquired disabilities is nothing but illogical rhetoric.

I have lived with gyno for most of my natural life until May 3, 2012 when I had the "deformity" corrected. I laugh at the statement earlier by another user that they wore compression garments for the comfort of others. LOL! Ridiculous! You wore it for the same reason we all did...years of being self-conscious about how we looked when the fabric of our clothing was too thin, or the wind blew too hard. Self-conscious about how that girl you liked would respond when you took your shirt off.

I feel like a new man since the surgery and have done things I've never done before, such as simply going to Schlitterbahn (a waterpark) and having the time of my life without a second thought about my "breasts." The fact we call them breasts, a female body part, says it all. I've wasted more time responding to the tigerpaw's and hammer's of the world than I wanted to, but wanted to let Monkey know he's not alone and thank him for identifying the issue for what it is.

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Offline Paa_Paw

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Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #20 on: August 14, 2012, 11:20:47 PM »
Might I suggest that this thread is in an open general section. If a person has an interest only in surgery, there are several headings for surgery.

All viewpoints are welcomed here.
Grandpa Dan

Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #21 on: August 15, 2012, 02:32:00 PM »
Each man is free (at least for now) to do as he pleases, if you believe that surgery will make you a better man then pay your money and take your chances.

But to ignore the simple fact that there are other options is narrow minded at best and a disservice to others who may not share your opinion of what is normal.

Read a little history, not very long ago is was "normal" for blacks to be segregated, it was "normal' for those of Japanese ancestry to be forcibly and illegally inturned in concentration camps, it was "normal" for black people to be held as slaves and to be treated as cattle. All of this and much more was "normal".

What is "normal"? As gynecomastia has many causes, what was "normal" before cosmetic surgery was a viable option?

I find you arguments to be shaded in you own personal beliefs and prejudices, rather than an understanding that there are many possibilities.
     

Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #22 on: August 21, 2012, 12:29:57 PM »
The fact of the matter is gynecomastia is considered a physical deformity. While I salute the fact that there are some people who who would rather accept their condition there are children that are going through the same stuff we went through on here and we have a moral obligation to try and help. I sincerely do appreciate the fact some people are okay with it, but unfortunately that mentality offers no solution.

Gynecomastia is not "normal". Men are not supposed to have feminized breasts, evidenced by the fact that it occurs only when there is a hormonal imbalance or some other factor introduced. I appreciate the spirit behind acceptance, but if anything I think that attitude actually hinders progress.

There are three things you can do with gyne: Accept it, hide it, or have it corrected. In most cases people want to have it corrected, so I think we should have a solution to the issue of appearance within the interim. Especially if there are children who come on here who are desperate for  answers.

Again, I appreciate the spirit of acceptance and salute and respect those who accept it on a personal level. However, I think we should probably drop the ideology that it's normal and society should accept it, and look for more efficient  and reasonable ways of dealing with this traumatic deformity.

I agree with you monkey83, people can be cruel...whether they mean to or not, consciously or sub-consciously... Society and Culture has a whole, has always shunned and rejected people that are different. All boys/men who have gynecomastia growing up, experience it first hand, I certainly have.

My Personal opinion is that if you were born or later developed anything that the majority of the population does not have, it is a deformity.. Deformity by definition is not normal. Why should anybody be put down or told to "Suck it up and just deal with it" on these boards or anywhere else, because we don't/won't except having this deformity?? That is so insensitive, and not anyone's place to try to dictate another's view of one's self..


Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #23 on: August 21, 2012, 07:38:51 PM »
The fact of the matter is gynecomastia is considered a physical deformity. While I salute the fact that there are some people who who would rather accept their condition there are children that are going through the same stuff we went through on here and we have a moral obligation to try and help. I sincerely do appreciate the fact some people are okay with it, but unfortunately that mentality offers no solution.

Gynecomastia is not "normal". Men are not supposed to have feminized breasts, evidenced by the fact that it occurs only when there is a hormonal imbalance or some other factor introduced. I appreciate the spirit behind acceptance, but if anything I think that attitude actually hinders progress.

There are three things you can do with gyne: Accept it, hide it, or have it corrected. In most cases people want to have it corrected, so I think we should have a solution to the issue of appearance within the interim. Especially if there are children who come on here who are desperate for  answers.

Again, I appreciate the spirit of acceptance and salute and respect those who accept it on a personal level. However, I think we should probably drop the ideology that it's normal and society should accept it, and look for more efficient  and reasonable ways of dealing with this traumatic deformity.

I agree with you monkey83, people can be cruel...whether they mean to or not, consciously or sub-consciously... Society and Culture has a whole, has always shunned and rejected people that are different. All boys/men who have gynecomastia growing up, experience it first hand, I certainly have.

My Personal opinion is that if you were born or later developed anything that the majority of the population does not have, it is a deformity.. Deformity by definition is not normal. Why should anybody be put down or told to "Suck it up and just deal with it" on these boards or anywhere else, because we don't/won't except having this deformity?? That is so insensitive, and not anyone's place to try to dictate another's view of one's self..


I am not deformed, it seems that your personal view of what is normal is a bit colored buy your own prejudices. Is a person who is born or looses a limb deformed? Are you THAT narrow minded that you can not accept anything that you believe is not in your view "normal"? You said
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not anyone's place to try to dictate another's view of one's self..
are you speaking out of both sides of your mouth?[/color]

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Offline y2015

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Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #24 on: August 21, 2012, 11:22:02 PM »
The fact is, men and women have instinctive biological notions of what is physically desirable and undesirable. This is why certain traits- smooth skin, athleticism, symmetrical faces, etc., are seen as desirable. This is why people are born with a certain sexual orientation they cannot change- because everyone's mind has a rough blueprint in his or her brain of what is and isn't attractive. Some of this is modifiable by society (the clothes we find attractive, what we see as status symbols, etc.), but basic signs of sexual dimorphism (breasts, genitalia, hip and shoulder width) are programmed into us for obvious biological reasons. They allow us to recognize who is the proper sex for mating purposes, and they help us recognize our species alone as mating partners. Traits in men that are recognized as female (large breasts) will never be seen as attractive by most, just as beards will never be seen as generally attractive in women. This does not mean that people with traits characteristic of the opposite sex should be treated badly, but it does mean that they will always be at a distinct disadvantage in terms of how other people (especially potential partners) view them. For young people, this is often very important. Because of our instinctive male and female "blueprints," breasts in males will never be seen as normal or desirable by friends and peers, no matter how much anyone tries to change that. I admire those of you who have learned to live with it, and if it genuinely doesn't bother you, there is absolutely no reason to think about changing it. However, it is important to recognize that having gynecomastia does change the way others see you, and if this is important to you (as it is for most people), it may be worth thinking about surgery.

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Offline hammer

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Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #25 on: August 22, 2012, 08:30:29 AM »
I have not said anything for awhile on this but I can not let this go! Y2015 if anyone gets gynecomastia surgery for thereself to help themself for what ever reason that they feel that they need to is fine! That is their individual decision to do so, and I support that.

However, if you think that we need to have the surgery because of what other people think of us, that is crazy at best! (I call your attention to the end of your last post).

If any of us have no problem will living with gynecomastia and others do, that is there problem not ours and we need not worry about them! I only need to please my God and my wife, and if they have no problem, why should anyone else, and why should I or we even care?

The Bible says, when I was hungry you feed me, when I was trusty you gave me a drink, and when I was naked you gave me a coat! I have yet to read when I had gynecomastia you gave me surgery.

There are many things the require surgery to improve quality of life even right from birth and if you read all the post on this forum you will find that there are men here that have been married for many years with many children, such as me! I have fathered 5 and my 3rd grandchild is overdue! I still am very much in love with the mother, grandmother of these kids. If this isn't a good life I don't know what is. So I fail to see that gynecomastia surgery is required to please other people.

As I said before, if you or anyone wishes to get surgery, go for it, but don't tell us that we should to please other people, as we don't need to please anyone but who in important in or own lives!


Bob aka Hammer

Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #26 on: August 22, 2012, 08:33:19 AM »
y2015,

While your post was thoughtful and well written, your perspective is skewed by your own prejudices and self image issues.

I know and have known many highly successful men with beards and an equal number of women find them attractive. While having gynecomastia could be seen as a hindrance to you, for me and others it is not. While the pool of women who are not put off by having fully developed breasts is smaller than the general population, it is simply up to the man to seek them out.

The same can be found for anything, some women are put off by smoking, chewing tobacco, being overweight, believing in a different deity  or having gynecomastia.

As with anything, life is what you make of it. If life hands you a basket of lemons, them make lemonade. Or you can wallow in your own self pity, the choice is up to each of us.
 

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Offline hammer

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Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #27 on: August 22, 2012, 08:35:24 AM »
What TigerPaws said! I second it

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Monkey83

Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #28 on: August 22, 2012, 07:50:48 PM »
We get it. You don't view gynecomsatia or any other deformity negatively, neither do we. We are using the word "deformity" without a negative connotation, in it's proper context. The sky is not falling, we are not persecuting the disabled. We are simply stating the facts, in an objective way. This is necessary in order to actually accept the condition as well as to seek out a solution.

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Offline y2015

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Re: Wear this combo, it works.
« Reply #29 on: August 23, 2012, 12:43:09 AM »
TigerPaws- I said *women* with beards, not men with beards. I am sure there are many attractive men with beards, haha. I gave the example of women with beards as an analogy for how men with breasts are seen by society.

Like Monkey said, obviously we have no problem with people who have gynecomastia- we suffer/suffered from this problem ourselves. And I don't doubt you have too- otherwise I don't see why you would be on this forum. For myself, I think that getting rid of the gynecomastia is a better option than teaching myself to live with it, because I think that it will always continue to bother me, at least a little bit. I see surgery for gynecomastia as similar to surgery for a cleft lip- it's a simple way to get rid of something that will otherwise inevitably cause the person who has it some social trouble, even though it is not really a health risk.

You all seem to have succeeded despite your gynecomastia, which I think is great. If I were in your situation, and I already had a family and grandchildren, I would probably not care about surgery either. It seems most older men have at least mild gynecomastia! As a young man, though, gynecomastia has caused me a lot of trouble, and there's really no reason I should force myself to keep on dealing with it.


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